Recoil3 problem |
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FloorPizza
Newbie Joined: 11/May/2009 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Posted: 11/May/2009 at 7:13pm |
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Mr. Hammer, you have just solved a huge problem I had with a Mytee 1001DX I rented last week. Unfortunately, I had already cleaned two rooms and didn't know it had been puking return water out of the one vacuum exhaust until I had the unit parked on a wood floor and saw the puddle. The previous two rooms had been soaked through to the pad, of course. I pulled up the carpet and had to put two area blowers on it to dry it. Luckily, this was on my own house, as I'm still way too much of a newb to clean anyone elses carpet (even for free). I had absolutely no idea why I kept getting water out of that darn vacuum exhaust. I must have looked in that return tank a hundred times and couldn't find anything wrong. However, I now realize that the tank inlet you refer to was pointing directly at the ball valve. I had my mind set on buying a Mytee 1000 series or M5 machine until I had this experience. Now that that riddle is solved, I'll consider putting the Mytee machines back in the list of contenders. HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE thank you for this!!!! |
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Ed Valentine
Carpet Cleaning Specialist Joined: 14/September/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 770 |
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Gentlemen;
I thought i would post a most recent e-mail received via this great board, from Laserman in regards to the situation he was having and the solution to his foaming problem. So, sorry Ken for your blindsided slap.
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duckcountry
Master Carpet Cleaner Joined: 29/October/2005 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1082 |
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isn't arm & hammer a good defoamer? baking soda seems like a cheap enough one.
And if he is cleaning with Ecogent, I think it is commonly known this is a high foaming cleaner. |
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Are you in a high paying business or are you just a self employed low paid grunt who thinks this business provides dignity?
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Just Ol' Willy
Senior Member Joined: 20/April/2007 Status: Offline Points: 147 |
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Uncle Willy's cheapo tip of the day_ Buy some cheap sponges from the dollar store, cut them in smaller sizes.. Soak some defoamer into them and run through the vac hose. It gives the hose a coat and lasts in the tank, as long as you don't toss it with the waste water when you drain, for a fair while.
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Ed Valentine
Carpet Cleaning Specialist Joined: 14/September/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 770 |
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CCandmore;
Any true air-flow; high-velocity CFM system is going to naturally--mix Air with Water, and the residues that it recovers--and therefore, it sometimes may have more of a tendency to cause these incoming residues/soaps to form as foam and rinse above the level of the water recovered. And since foam is a lot lighter than water and because of the extremely air-flow in the recovery tank, it could be more of a common senerio under certain and particular situations and thus vacuumed thru the vacuum motors. (But, not always, btw)
HOWEVER, this is dependent largely upon the particular cleaning agents being used, as you had allutted to, or what was already left behind in the carpet fibers. And, this will largely be dependent on whether the Operator is required to use defoamer, or not. (Keeping in mind that not all defoamers are the same based on quality concentrations, etc..)
Keep in mind that cleaning deep into the carpet fibers and achieving total and through extraction (hopefully) is everyones goal. At least it should be in this business! Therefore, on less efficient machines, or those generic machines with less vacuum are less prevelant at times to capture the amount of residue(s) that a true High-Performance system would.
I also believe that we must keep in mind that foaming is not only created from SOAP left in carpets but also we must consider this same problem (if we let it become one, btw...) whenever we clean a hard floor. The incoming water will really Slam into that recovery tank and must be calmed down at times with a good grade defoamer.
Hope that helps answer your question.
Ed Valentine
cross-american corp.
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CCandmore
Senior Member Joined: 07/December/2006 Location: Virginia, USA Status: Offline Points: 150 |
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Ed, is defoamer usually needed with the Recoil or does it depend on the chems used?
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Ed Valentine
Carpet Cleaning Specialist Joined: 14/September/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 770 |
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Thanks to all , for the great ideas and help above to laserman (Barry).
His problem from day one was: Foaming.
He called me approx 5-6 weeks ago, and told me "Problem solved".
He had a special defoamer device installled on the vacuum port inlet of his machine and told me that he placed a pail behind the vacuum exhaust so that he could run a test and see if any foam was being blown out. He checked this about every 5 mins just to make sure [!!] when he was using the machine on the job site. And, he found that ---not one drop---of foam was being blown out. "Problem solved"!!! Now, he stated that he was happy.
3-4 weeks later he called me and stated that the defoamer was too expensive and he was going broke buying it from his Supplier. I mentioned to him that I did not sell him the defoamer; there are different concentrations of defoamers; and so on.
Now if the machine (in his words, written on May 13th btw) "I've said it before, I know the machine is AWESOME, cleans great, dries fast, etc..if I could just solve this problem".,
His problem is FOAM from carpets and/or hard floor cleaning.
Don't know unfortunately, what to do beyond the efforts we have put into this situation. Sent him a new air-deflector/ CFM lid also, to no avail.
The very best to all and especially to Barry. I hope he solves his problem but his problem is not with his machine or how it was built.
Ed Valentine
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Just Ol' Willy
Senior Member Joined: 20/April/2007 Status: Offline Points: 147 |
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I've thought about this all day.Is your deflector turned downward? Mine gets tossed in and out of a truck all day, and one time I chafed a small pinhole in the rubber drainage boot on the side- check to see if your getting any air in there or just call me. I'll pm you my number.
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duckcountry
Master Carpet Cleaner Joined: 29/October/2005 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1082 |
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While pouring in a defoamer may be costly (not that much though) and time consuming and one more thing to remember, considering the costly damage from not doing it should convince someone. Don't be chincy on the defoamer.
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Are you in a high paying business or are you just a self employed low paid grunt who thinks this business provides dignity?
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Just Ol' Willy
Senior Member Joined: 20/April/2007 Status: Offline Points: 147 |
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Two other things to check for- see that the boot is fully tightened as well as the drain valve. Clean out the waste tank and silicone or goop the area around the bottom of the stacks. I'm coming up to 2 years using my Recoil and have had little in the way of grief. Good luck!
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FriendlyHammer
Master Carpet Cleaner Joined: 08/July/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1383 |
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One more thing. I haven't seen the inside of a Recoil, but I have a problem with Mytee machines that sounds like the problem you have having. In the bigger Mytee machines, there a rubber thing just inside the tank where the water comes in. It is supposed to direct water downward, but it tends to get turned once in a while and gets directed at the ball valve. When this happens, the incoming water forces the ball downward while going directly into the vac pipe (yikes!). I've walked into rooms that my guys are cleaing and seen pools of water 4 feet wide!
So you may want to check other things that might have gotten moved around. Edited by FriendlyHammer - 18/May/2008 at 2:28am |
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Ken Harris Nov 08:
"This will cause oil to rise to near $100 by the end of November. It stays up there to about the end of February. Better save this so you know who told it to you first." |
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FriendlyHammer
Master Carpet Cleaner Joined: 08/July/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1383 |
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The float valve is easy, and the ball valve is a litte more tricky.
On the float valve, you simply bend the arm of the float so that it is lower (closer to the dirty water). The collar of the float valve (the ring that holds it to the pipe) can also sometimes act like a straw and pull water between the collar and the pipe, so that will need to be checked and sealed with some kind of removable goo of some sort. However, lowering the float enough can keep the water below the collar, too. I don't see float valves around as much as I used to, but I prefer them.
On the ball valve, you first have to make sure the cage is totally clean and that the ball has no water in it. If it has water in it, that will explain why it doesn't close sooner (it will have to be replaced). However, if everything is fine, you can wrap a piece of electrical tape near the top of the cage (on the wire mesh near the opening) so that the valve is more sensitive (the air intake is closer to the ball). It will take some experimentation to figure out just how much is needed.
Also, if you move a machine around when it is almost full, water will get around the valve just before the valve closes. There's really nothing that can be done about that, except to stop moving the machine when it's almost full. Everyone has that problem.
Finally, you can test the tank by filling it up with water and making sure the valve is closed while the machine is on and the tank lid is closed. If water keeps coming out of the bottom, the water is leaking around some hole in the tank somewhere. This is unlikely because the dirt would easily fill such a hole and make any leak stop or be unnoticeable. But remember, if you have a float valve, the collar can act like a straw in this situation, so you will have to follow my instructions above in this situation. Edited by FriendlyHammer - 18/May/2008 at 2:29am |
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Ken Harris Nov 08:
"This will cause oil to rise to near $100 by the end of November. It stays up there to about the end of February. Better save this so you know who told it to you first." |
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Laserman
Groupie Joined: 01/March/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 55 |
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Hammer,
How I can I adjust my Recoil to stop this problem? Maybe that's the problem. Ed says it's a foam problem and he surely knows more than I do , but it does the same thing when I clean tile and rinse with just water. Other than this problem the Recoil works just great. I hate seeing water/foam leak out of the exhaust cause I fear I will ruin the vac motors. Barry |
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FriendlyHammer
Master Carpet Cleaner Joined: 08/July/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1383 |
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I've got the same problem with several machines (castex, mytee, ect). The issue is always the valve. Be it a float valve or ball valve, it needs to be adjusted to be more sensitive. In a high cfm machine the vacuums can suck off the surface of the water before the valve kicks in. I'm constanly tweeking those things because of the same problem.
It's a fact of life.
Edited by FriendlyHammer - 14/May/2008 at 12:24am |
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Ken Harris Nov 08:
"This will cause oil to rise to near $100 by the end of November. It stays up there to about the end of February. Better save this so you know who told it to you first." |
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