acid rinses

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   How important is this method and when and how do you use this. So far we have not used this method. We used to only Dry Clean using Bonnets. Now with a TM Looks as if Acid rinsining will be need to be addressed. Do you do this after cleaning so in turn double work which means more work if so I think I should keep pushing the Bonnet Dry Clean method due to it being easy and safe. Input on this subject appreciated.

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77748 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 12/August/2004 Status: Offline Points: 298	Post Options Post Reply Quote 77748 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: acid rinses Posted: 15/September/2004 at 2:45am
	How important is this method and when and how do you use this. So far we have not used this method. We used to only Dry Clean using Bonnets. Now with a TM Looks as if Acid rinsining will be need to be addressed. Do you do this after cleaning so in turn double work which means more work if so I think I should keep pushing the Bonnet Dry Clean method due to it being easy and safe. Input on this subject appreciated.

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splash_$$$_dash Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Carpet Cleaning Specialist Joined: 07/April/2004 Location: Toronto Status: Offline Points: 742	Post Options Post Reply Quote splash_$$$_dash Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 4:54am
	we use to roto with shampoo and plastic shampoo brush which creates a lot of foam, then rinse with a 100-200psi machine using acid. (My buddy at ServiceMaster uses this system exclusively)

surroundings Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 27/June/2004 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 243	Post Options Post Reply Quote surroundings Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 8:27am
	77748: I have stated it just earlier tonight on another post, but I'll restate in more detail here: The Australian / New Zealand Carpet Cleaner's Standard states something along the lines of carpets are to be left in a slightly acidic condition. Later this week I might look up the exact wording for you. I have been taught that using an acid either as a post-spray or in the rinse will prevent browning, minimise wick-back, and help break down any residual detergents that might have been left after HWE. Detergents left in the carpet will lead to resoiling. My acid rinse of choice is Fab-Set by Bridgepoint, but I'm sure that there are many products equally able to achieve the same outcome. After cleaning carpets (HWE) I lightly spray this product on then rake. When cleaning upholstery, I run it through my freshwater tank. I have not yet had a callback due to too much detergent left in the carpet (sticky carpet, or rapid resoiling), browning, or stains 'reappearing' after I have left the premisis. Is it due to the Fab-Set? I dunno, but I'm not going to stop using it in the name of scientific experimentation. I do not know much about chemical dry cleaning methods, or if/how an acid rinse is to be applied after. It is best to seek advise from other professionals who use this method more frequently. Most HWE detergents are alkaline, so to meet the Aus/NZ standard, an acid is required. What is the PH of the carpet after you have finished? I'd be interested in knowing what the Canadian or US Standards (if any) state. Can anyone help here? -Allen

surroundings Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 27/June/2004 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 243	Post Options Post Reply Quote surroundings Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 8:32am
	BTW: It doesn't DOUBLE your work! Spraying it on takes only moments. Using it in your freshwater takes only the amount of time you need to measure. The cost of the product is minimal. The benifits? I've 'fixed' a browning problem from another CC'er by doing another HWE, and (in this case) using my acid in my freshwater. Once again, I have not had any of these problems in the 7 months I've been in business for myself, and I offer a 'service back' guarentee for my customers. -Allen

Superglide Ken Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Grand Potentate SGK Joined: 17/March/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 4868	Post Options Post Reply Quote Superglide Ken Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 11:18am
	I use it nearly all the time when cleaning. Only time I don't is when cleaning trashed synthetic carpet. Then I use the detergency of both the Prespray and solution to get it clean. That is what the customer is paying for.
	Inventor of the Teflon Wand Glide and the Turboteck Rotary Air Duct Cleaners for TMs.

doug Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List King of the One Liners Just My opinion Joined: 31/January/2004 Status: Offline Points: 32711	Post Options Post Reply Quote doug Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 11:41am
	[ After cleaning carpets (HWE) I lightly spray this product on then rake. When cleaning upholstery, I run it through my freshwater tank. I have not yet had a callback due to too much detergent left in the carpet (sticky carpet, or rapid resoiling), browning, or stains 'reappearing' after I have left the premisis. QUOTE] Allen: How and what do you use to apply the acid rinse? How much time is added to you drying times. Do you apply fabric protector and if so how many times do you spray the carpte after cleaning? If you put it in your rinse tank and you applu your cleaner by a hydroforce etc. you hav ejust cut the ph of your cleaner. You can't put your cleaner in your fresh water tank if you are adding rinse to your water. SO?
	Just My opinion

surroundings Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 27/June/2004 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 243	Post Options Post Reply Quote surroundings Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 3:15pm
	Doug: I apply Fab-Set either by post spray 'n' rake using my pump up sprayer when I'm doing carpets, -or- when I do upholstry, I put Fab-Set into my freshwater tank (I'll add the apropriate amount INTO the tank and fill it, rather then use the chemical metering tips. I don't keep the auto-fill working when I use this method) I do not know how much extra dry time is needed with the post spray method. I apply a fairly light cover.... so it shouldn't greatly extend the dry time. The dry time should not change when I run it through my freshwater tank... but I'm not 100% certain that the evaporation rate would be the same as H2O. Any help here? Bridgepoint recommend using Fab-Set to leave the carpets in a better state to recieve their 'Maxim' carpet & upholstery protector, which I also spray on, but now as a seperate stage (when the customer chooses to pay for this option). I had been told once that it was OK to mix these two, but I don't think my information was acurate. I do not own a hydroforce sprayer yet, so the detergent, acid & protector is put on via a 2-gal TWBS sprayer with a 'fan' tip. I have two of them (should get a third) one is used exclusively for detergent, the other is used for both the final stages, but is rinsed out in between. No change to the PH of my detergent with this method. I NEVER run cleaning detergents through my machine's freshwater, just like I don't run shampoo through my showerhead..... What's your take on this? Ways to improve? Obviously getting a couple of solution-line sprayers would help with time involved and consistancy of product applied, but those are not in my shopping cart for the very near future. Thanks, Allen

Jim Darling Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 29/January/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 159	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jim Darling Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 3:25pm
	For what it is worth - I do not recommend spraying an acid rinse on the carpet and leaving it. There are some health concerns here. The better products that are sold in the marketplace contain natural acids and in spite of what you might feel about the word "natural" these should be rinsed off the carpet. I would recommend applying your prespray and then run your acid rinse through your fresh water. This will acheive the same results and remove the majority of the acid rinse from the carpet
	Jim Darling

doug Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List King of the One Liners Just My opinion Joined: 31/January/2004 Status: Offline Points: 32711	Post Options Post Reply Quote doug Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 5:03pm
	Jim: You are so political correct with you contibutions.
	Just My opinion

77748 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 12/August/2004 Status: Offline Points: 298	Post Options Post Reply Quote 77748 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 6:05pm
	I do not use a fresh water tank. A high pressure garden hose to the TM. So can you run this in the Hdro Force with Pre Spray or after cleaning clean the pre spray hydroforce and use in the hydroforce or seperate pre spray container and very light mist it and rake to groom.

Superglide Ken Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Grand Potentate SGK Joined: 17/March/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 4868	Post Options Post Reply Quote Superglide Ken Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 6:25pm
	77748: You can still meter it into the rinse water from the hose AFTER you have applied the preconditioner with the hydroforce. Course if you use an electic sprayer or pumpup sprayer, meter it in the incoming water all the time, WITH ONE EXCEPTION. Never use an acid rinse in houses where marble stone is close to the carpet. Refinishing is just too expensive. On those houses, fresh water rinse only.
	Inventor of the Teflon Wand Glide and the Turboteck Rotary Air Duct Cleaners for TMs.

77748 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 12/August/2004 Status: Offline Points: 298	Post Options Post Reply Quote 77748 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 7:55pm
	Dumb stupid question the term fresh water rinse. How do you do that. I pre-spray lightly with my pre spray mix from I believe Chemspec. I then use the steamer TM which has formula 90 and energiser. I know not to overwet the carpet now the fresh water rinse can you please elaborate on how. By the time I am done here I will be a Master Cleaner. Yeeahhh!!Thanks!

Superglide Ken Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Grand Potentate SGK Joined: 17/March/2004 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 4868	Post Options Post Reply Quote Superglide Ken Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 9:05pm
	Fresh water rinse means no detergent in the water you rinse the capet with, meaning no 90, or anything . All deturgentency is in the preconditioner you put down BEFORE you put your wand into action. The rinse water is what comes from your wand. With some people the rinse water is both the wash water and the rinse water cause they do not precondition.
	Inventor of the Teflon Wand Glide and the Turboteck Rotary Air Duct Cleaners for TMs.

77748 Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Journeyman Joined: 12/August/2004 Status: Offline Points: 298	Post Options Post Reply Quote 77748 Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 15/September/2004 at 10:44pm
	OK! So what you are saying is for example your hydroforce would be your prespray and then there would be no 5 gallon solution hose hooked up with the freshwater in other words no chemical just freshwater and vacuum blower. If this is true all my chemicals would be used such as enzal, formula 90, energiser, nuetralizer and deoderizer would be mixed with water in thehydroforce. Bingo this is your acid rince! Tell me this is right.

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acid rinses