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PadMan View Drop Down
Dr. Low Moisture
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PadMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26/March/2010 at 10:49pm
If they are running red buffer pads, I sure as heck didn't train them...LOL
 
I NEVER run a buffer pad on carpet, I did ONCE but that was on a carpet with a test product that made the carpet stiff,  I red buffer padded it then vacuumed, that did the trick but other than that NO BUFFER pads for me.
Converting HWE customer to VLM customers for 30 Years!
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MR. STEAMER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MR. STEAMER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/March/2010 at 12:35am
Originally posted by FreshAire FreshAire wrote:

Methinks Mr Steamer is steamy by personality -dam but he gets hot under the collar doesn't he? Oh well, I'll keep to my opinions formed from 22 years working my carpet cleaning business, same as you, based on training I have received  and now pass on to other guys, as well valuable info I have received helping to do research...
I answered your question...didn't I
 
did you get the answer you want????
 
what no comment????
 
I know guys that have been cleaning for 22 years doing it the same wrong way...
 
I heard about a guy working at Servicemaster for over 20 years that didn't know a truckmount existed.
 
just because you are doing it for a long time doesn't mean you know what you are doing
.
 
The difference between me and you...is I love what I do....
www.mr-steamer.com
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PadMan View Drop Down
Dr. Low Moisture
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PadMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/March/2010 at 6:29am
So then loving it means you are doing it right?
Converting HWE customer to VLM customers for 30 Years!
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MR. STEAMER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MR. STEAMER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/March/2010 at 3:54pm
Originally posted by PadMan PadMan wrote:

So then loving it means you are doing it right?
YUP because if you don't love what you do...you wouldn't care... loving is caring and taking the time to make sure you do it right.
 
 
www.mr-steamer.com
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PadMan View Drop Down
Dr. Low Moisture
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PadMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27/March/2010 at 9:56pm
I have always loved what I do, must be doing it right then..
 
Thanks
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FreshAire View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreshAire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 12:23am
The main difference between you and me Steamer is that I'm willing to investigate and learn, you're quick to give an opinion and then not budge from it because it is your opinion. You're entitled to it and I used to be on a similar wavelength to you having been a dedicated T/M HWE guy for 17 years, and then Encapsulation cleaning came along, which let's face it, when you break it down simply is a modernised extension of the old Wet Shampoo method.

I started using it because a couple of gallons was given to me for free to play with - and blow me down if I didn't start getting some amazing results with!! That is my experience and I have done a lot of research into it chemically and procedure-wise and it is now an integral part of my service as I have found it a more than valid weapon in my arsenal. I am also curious by nature ands sceptical of claims made by others trying to sell me something, so I have to prove it for myself, one way or the other.

Try using it more and come to it with an open mind and you too, like me, may even change it. Just because it didn't work for you on one or two jobs is no reason to write it off. If you had used your truckmount with no knowledge, overwet or otherwise damaged your first two jobs because no-one had ever trained you properly, does that make HWE invalid as well? I have seen that happen many a time before and a lot of people are wary of HWE systems because of prior bad experiences with so-called carpet cleaners that damaged their precious carpets using HWE.

If you understood the chemistry and what happens post-clean with encapsulation cleaning (and then there's OP which is another step up the scale of effectiveness), then you probably would retract a lot of what you have said thus far. Instead all you have shown thus far is ignorance on the system, as I probably would have done 5 years ago as well. All I know is that after much trial and tribulation (no-one was there to train me either, I was the first one in my State to start using it!), I find myself with a cleaning system that works, one that my customers are happy with, is easier, faster to do and not to mention cheaper than pushing a wand around especially in a commercial situation and earns me a lot more money.

As for the case of that customer that went from monthly cleans with someone else @ $60 a shot to my yearly clean @ $440 a shot - because I love my job too and am prepared to put 110% into every job I do but demand to get paid for it - well I suppose I can say that I am technically $280 worse off per year as he was getting $720 in the same time frame on that one job. But, I only go there once, not 12 times, and I have a happy customer who has referred me quite a bit of work because of the difference in result. And further to that, in those 11 times I didn't go there, I was free to find 11 others who are willing pay the same amount and in some cases based on my customer's good word, so that's over $5000 in the same period the other guy earns $720.

So, who's the fool? Wink By the way the "fool" comment is not aimed at you Steamer, but at the "other guy". I'm not here for a slanging match but like you said, I piped up cos I hate Bull$hit being slung around, whether it be because someone is misinformed, unaware or has hidden agendas i.e. someone peddling something and feeding suckers like us incorrect info.

So I challenge you, go find someone who knows about the system, open your mind and then make a value judgement on it. You may even be as surprised yourself as I have been over the years since starting with this system...

Never too old to learn Smile
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MR. STEAMER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MR. STEAMER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 3:50am
HUH I think you missed the point of it all freshair...
 
I know exactly what I need to know from the production of chemicals(family business sort of)  to the building of all types of cleaning equipment(that means I know alot more than just turning the things on) to many different types and arts of cleaning(YUP)
 
Most carpet cleaners are being fooled..... from the people who produce the product to the people who produce the equipment.....
 
Cleaners believe everything they read on the label ...lol
 
Read from the start...I think you're lost... no one is downing op or anyother type method.....  I just don't agree the VLM is cleaner than anything else....just another shade of dirty...and those bad spills are really still there....you know the one that keeps coming back everytime it's been HWE... but never comes back once vlm'd...guess what ...??? it's still there...LOL
 
but I guess I can formulate my words so you can understand that...
 
I'm weak....and tired
 
good luck freshaire
 
I'm's doneLOL
www.mr-steamer.com
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MR. STEAMER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MR. STEAMER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 3:54am
Originally posted by PadMan PadMan wrote:

So then loving it means you are doing it right?
never said that you didn't
 
I just wanted you to admit...that even though we say it's clean(no matter what method) it really isn't clean.
 
it really just "looks clean"
 
some cleaner than others so we can say different shades of clean
 
or  how I like to say it different shades of dirtyApprove
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FreshAire View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreshAire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 6:46am
No argument from me there, no cleaning system is 100% effective, but there are ways and means of increasing the effectiveness, and it may not necessarily mean using just one system! As long as you're getting paid for energy expended you can mix'n'match to your benefit (as well as your customer's carpets!)
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PadMan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PadMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 9:41am
I coined the phrase many years ago, "that you can NEVER totally clean a gravity fed medium".
 
So this whole thread was pointless.
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doug View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote doug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 10:17am
Not really John it was entertaining and educational??
Just My opinion
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FreshAire View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreshAire Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 10:35am
Ok now that we're settled down and actually communicating, I'm curious as to the conditions where you state that the stain "keeps coming back" if you HWE after OP cleaning. Having never had that happen to me I'd like to know under what circumstance it was that you've seen this.

Could it be an operator error - previous guy's, not yours? Or could it have been a chemistry issue - let's face it, some of the cleaning agents being sold out there are far from true encapsulants and make things worse rather than better! Could that have been the issue in your scenario? And what was the staining medium to start with? It's quite possible that the OP system effectively cleaned the face yarns, but obviously cannot draw through from below the primary and/or secondary backings of a tufted carpet. Hit it with moisture tho, especially at high pressure and particularly on a 100% polypropylene carpet, and you have the potential for migration of the original staining medium from the backing, as the top surfaces may possibly have been wet through right through to the backings. If you'd have OP'd it again you'd probably have been none the wiser, but HWE does have the potential to create such a problem.

So, was it OP not effectively cleaning, was it operator error, was it inferior cleaning agents or a combination of any one or all of the above...?

Blaming it all on OP not cleaning effectively is a long bow to draw, I'd like to draw on all evidence possible. Prove my thoughts wrong Steamer and I'll thank you cos I'll have learnt something, but if you are simply stating an opinion devoid of fact, then I'll challenge you to look at it further yourself.

Either way it's been a great debate so far Boxing lolz
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Michael View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Michael Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 2:18pm
Originally posted by MR. STEAMER MR. STEAMER wrote:

Originally posted by PadMan PadMan wrote:

A LOT more dirt removed from carpet...
I noticed you said A LOT of dirt....is that what you tell the customers...

[QUOTE=MR. STEAMER]
I just wanted you to admit...that even though we say it's clean(no matter what method) it really isn't clean.
 
it really just "looks clean"

Is that what you tell your customers?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MR. STEAMER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28/March/2010 at 4:15pm
I say "it will look alot better...than what it is now"
 
it will look cleaner...
 
that\s what the people want to hear
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